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Venting: dog park

Discussion in 'Dog Debates' started by Chevypride, Aug 19, 2015.

  1. SSalinas

    SSalinas Puppy

    The thing is... 'Chevypride' posted that they took a 4 month old puppy to the dog park and I feel like 'BCdogs' was unfair in the initial response.

    And sence this is a "debate"....I feel like DISCRIMINATION is bad.

    All puppies/young dogs need to be exposed to the world of dog parks. Just because I have a bully breed... Don't tell me that I should "self discriminate" and keep my dog away from anywhere all dogs are allowed to go.

    I get it... Your arguments for staying away from dog parks are valid, it's just dangerous. But a 4 month old puppy... It has ever right to be there. In fact it should be encouraged.
     
  2. ETRaven2

    ETRaven2 Big Dog

    Dogs don't 'need' friends. They aren't human. Additionally, they do need to be socialized and exposed to different things and environments. I'm the first one to tell someone to implement rule of Sevens. However, a pup is going to pick up bad habits, rude behavior and disease from dog parks. Little else.
     
    Worg and Nat Ursula like this.
  3. LeighAnn

    LeighAnn Little Dog Premium Member

    I have had a very similar argument in recent past regarding sheltering bully breeds. I feel in agreeance with you on many levels of 'self discrimination' all the while respecting the often too common characteristics and patterns of almost all bully breeds. My understanding is bully breeds, in order to be out and about at other events.. do require an experienced dog owner/handler that have some decent knowledge of dog behavior and body language that often do send subtle signals before attacks actually do happen.

    I often cringe when I hear of NEW DOG OWNERS getting their first dog ever and it's a Pit Mix or Bull breed of some type.. It's a recipe for disaster with owners who may not understand the needs of proper exercise, supervised social stimulation and mental stimulation.. I respect the breed but I don't let this stigma stop me from including my dogs with events and other activities.. i just have to play a little smarter than the average individual with a standard, more acceptable breed in today's judgemental society.
     
    EstyEsty and SSalinas like this.
  4. BCdogs

    BCdogs Good Dog Staff Member Super Moderator

    Okay, no one said you have to keep your dog locked up like a prisoner. That’s ridiculous. There are many more safe and effective ways to exercise your dog than letting it loose with a bunch of strange dogs.
     
    ETRaven2 and pitbulldogs like this.
  5. Michele

    Michele Chi Super Dog Staff Member Administrator

    And I want to add this................I know for me, my dog is up to date on everything; shots, heartworm, etc. I don't know if other people are as diligent as I am and I'm not taking any chances of my dog catching anything from other dogs.
     
  6. SSalinas

    SSalinas Puppy

    Teach... Don't ridicule! Because I see nothing wrong with trying to socialize your dog at any place you are alowall to take pets. My male wouldn't know how to lift up his leg when he pees if it hadn't been for bog parks. :D

    My advice:
    Make sure your dog is well trained before taking them anyway! With that sad, we often don't know what to work on until we get out there... in the real world. So, always be watchful.... Because you are responsible for what happens to that dog.
     
  7. Michele

    Michele Chi Super Dog Staff Member Administrator

    I'm going to remember this post when you come back here to tell us your dog either got attacked OR attacked another dog at the dog park.
     
  8. Worg

    Worg Big Dog

    I agree with @LeighAnn and my point was that most pit/bully owners just arent prepared for what taking one around other dogs involves.

    @SSalinas We dont live in a perfect world, and that's what using that phrase means, ideally things would be different but it's just not like that in reality. Theres a very specific kind of dog that thrives at a dog park, but a majority of them you see there are not that kind of dog. Bringing a puppy to a dog park not only puts their health at risk but exposed them to a large number of poorly behaved dogs that will only make the puppy's training fall backward. There are other ways to socialize a puppy than throwing them in the middle of a bunch of unfamiliar dogs owned by strangers. There are play dates and some places/people even host puppy play days. I think meeting up with a friend who you know has a well mannered dog is ideal.

    That aside, dogs do not need dog friends and many are better off not having them. The mentality that dogs are like kids and need friends is baseless and dangerous.
     
    ETRaven2 and LeighAnn like this.
  9. pitbulldogs

    pitbulldogs OHMUHGERD Staff Member Administrator

    It's not about anything other than HSUS and BSL, period! It's not about us and our views or how the dogs feel, it's about the future of our breed and the only way it will work is by being responsible and aware of the breeds history. The fact is your dogs may never do anything, they may never show signs of aggression but YOUR DOGS AREN'T THE PROBLEM, it's the other dogs there and if and when something happens, which dog gets the blame adding to more bite statistics?! You bet your ass it's the blocky headed dog that they will point the finger at which tarnishes all of our dogs due to BSL laws.

    I take my dogs everywhere BUT the dog park! They don't need play dates and friends. Do they need socialized? Yes. Is they're more ways to do so other than a dog park? YES! But... I can see where this is going...

    Typical fur mommy hard head, thinks you can socialize and love the genetics out of them and that their dog is so well trained and behaved that they have nothing to worry about. 8-|
     
    BCdogs, Worg, Michele and 1 other person like this.
  10. ETRaven2

    ETRaven2 Big Dog

    ^This
    Dog parks aren't natural for dogs.
    To say that it's the only way to teach your dog how to lift his leg to pee is ridiculous and not a relevant argument in support of dog parks.
     
    EstyEsty and Worg like this.
  11. Novy

    Novy Little Dog Premium Member

    Here's my issue with dog parks: your dog might be great, until you encounter a dog that is full of attitude that can't physically back that attitude up. Bull breeds are strong and determined dogs, so if they are challenged it could get ugly. And regardless of who was actually to blame, which dog is going to have the finger pointed at them? That answer is too easy.

    Here is a great example,, I remember this particular instance well: https://www.google.ca/amp/torontosu.../wcm/ba946217-2527-49fa-8dc8-65a7a09c628d/amp

    A man is walking his 3 pitbulls across the street from an off leash dog park. Two dogs who are not under the control of their owners come across the street and start shit. One is a Pomeranian and the other a young Great Pyrenees. Not exactly an even match. Pom ends up dead, the Pyrenees ends up injured.

    This story spread LIKE WILDFIRE, from coast to coast. Of course every media outlet was singling out the pitbulls as being in the wrong. People rallying for increased BSL, using this to further an agenda of how terrible pitbulls are. The dogs didn't go looking for a fight, the fight found them.

    At the time you could search Calgary dog park attack on Google and literally get thousands of links pertaining to this story. I managed to trip across something incredibly damning while browsing through one of the media outlet's sites. There were actually two instances of a dog being killed at a dog park in Calgary that month. The second one involved some sort of shepherd mix killing a Yorkie. I was just lucky to trip across this, because there was only one fricken media outlet who published anything at all about this attack. I spent hours trying different search parameters to find at least some shred of evidence that the second fatal attack was getting any media attention at all. I found nothing aside from the one article. Anyone with half a brain would know that second instance was almost entirely swept under the rug because there was no "pitbulls are dangerous" angle.

    This whole thing was a huge eye opener to me as to just how villainous our dogs are perceived and the extent of the witch hunt in the media. It was beyond troubling. And it caused me to reflect on my experiences because any one of us could be in the shoes of that owner who faced a ton of stress and scrutiny just because some dogs decided to mess with his pitbulls that were minding their own business. At that time I'd only owned Iris for 6 months. In the first few months I had her I hit up the local dog park regularly during daytime hours when it was usually unoccupied. I was there to work on recall and ensure she could handle off leash wilderness adventures. Due to her being reactive, she needs slow introductions with most dogs, so if anyone else showed up I was quick to get her leashed and head for the exit. Until one day somebody pulled up quick and just immediately let their poodle in. It made a beeline for us, didn't even slow down to sniff just flat out attacked Iris. It lasted all of about 3 seconds when the other dog realized it was over matched and took off. And we promptly left, never to return. When discussing this with my aunt who frequented this dog park, she said the dog that went after Iris was notorious for doing that. So I quizzed her a bit on how often there were scuffles there, and she said all the time. I don't need to get mixed up in shit like that. Our dogs are persecuted enough, there's no sense flirting with disaster and putting them in a situation where they'd be the bad dog regardless of facts.
     
    LeighAnn, Worg and pitbulldogs like this.
  12. Worg

    Worg Big Dog

    @Novy totally agree, I used to take my brothers GSD to the dog park (anxious dog but otherwise extremely friendly) and I saw a pattern of a specific kind of idiot owner. This dog park has a small dog section, but people with aggressive small dogs would go into the larger dog park section so their dog couldn't hurt other dogs.... WTF??? Most often it was mini Schnauzers, French Bulldogs and Chihauhuas. Only a matter of time before they attack the wrong dog.

    Bringing more than 2 dogs is just a bad idea IMO no matter the breed. Worst attacks I saw were by 4 great Danes a lady had absolutely no control over, they would attack several dogs every time they came. 2 dogs are usually a lot easier than 3 or more.
     
  13. pitbulldogs

    pitbulldogs OHMUHGERD Staff Member Administrator

    =D>
     
  14. Eden86

    Eden86 Little Dog

    I’m still stuck on loose dogs going up to a leashed dog. Usually a leashed dog in an off lead area is a huge red flag for me. So the first attack I can maybe excuse as unlucky, but the second one? The moment the first dog got attacked all dogs should have been back on the lead and gone. Why risk it at that point? I’ve had enough instances with other dogs that I just avoid them if I can, even though Grace is happy to ignore most dogs. Flip side to that is she nearly plowed through the fence to get at the neighbors dog when it started barking at me. My 99% of the time non aggressive 8 month old pup knocked out two fence pailings to attack another dog she’s been around her whole life so as much as I’d love her to socialise with everything she’s not getting off lead puppy play dates at a dog park. Not worth it.
     
    Worg likes this.
  15. Kit

    Kit Good Dog

    Taking ANY dog to a dog park is a bad idea...may reasons have already been stated. Taking a PUPPY of any breed, to a dog park is an even worse idea.
    "Bad dogs are really bad owners and good dogs are products of good owners." REALLY?????
    A good dog is going to be a good dog no matter who owns it. It may be better with a good owner, but it's not going to be a bad dog. A good owner knows how to deal with a 'bad dog' so it appears to be a good dog. I've had DA dogs, but I managed them and never had a real issue.

    My 2 youngest dogs were raised pretty much the same way. Went to work with me every day for the first few months we had them. Went to puppy classes, dog-friendly stores, agility trials/class, etc.
    One is a social butterfly, outgoing, loves people and dogs.
    The other one is scared of people and would rather eat most other dogs if given the chance.
    Dogs are going to be who they are, regardless of their owner. A good owner manages the dog they have, a bad owner doesn't.
     
    brindle likes this.
  16. Worg

    Worg Big Dog

    There really are some dogs with some loose screws, just like people. This is a huge reason one should avoid backyard breeders, most unstable dogs come from such.

    It would be more accurate to say there are no bad BREEDS, there's only incompatible expectations, not every breed is suitable for what someone wants. No one here is saying DA makes a BAD DOG, that would mean a fair amount of the regulars have bad dogs and that isn't true. Some here might not even buy a dog if it weren't DA.
     
    LeighAnn likes this.
  17. oldman

    oldman Little Dog

    In another incident last week, a pit bull attacked and killed another dog during a walk in the Savannah Station neighborhood in the city of Alachua, Florida. The deceased dog's owner told police that she and her mother were walking 7-year-old Fred when the attack took place. The incident was caught on camera, and the video went viral on Facebook.

    Earlier this month, a 70-year-old Georgia woman was left disfigured and her Siberian Husky dead after being attacked by a pit bull. The incident sparked outrage among the neighbors who were concerned about the breed.

    In August this year, a two-year-old boy died from injuries caused during an attack by a pair of pit bull dogs inside a Philadelphia home. Police arrived at the scene and found six pit bulls inside the home. Two of the pit bulls were attacking the boy and another adult, according to reports. The police fired at all the dogs inside the house and in the process, killed them all.

    In June, Delta Air Lines banned “pit bull-type dogs,” from flying in their aircrafts, both as pets as well as emotional support animals.
     
  18. brindle

    brindle Little Dog

    I've not read this entire thread recently but I've read many others on this topic….

    Back when I first had dogs there was no such thing as a "dog park". So I never had any use for such a thing. From what I have seen, it is more for the owners than for the dogs. I'd say it could be an interesting observation on dog behavior and signals to go sit on the side lines and watch other people's dogs and how they relate, but I would never take my own dog to one.

    I would not take a puppy to one either, there are much better ways to social a pup in a controlled environment. You have no control over what dogs are at a dog park at any given time. It is just a bad idea for most dogs. I would not have taken my border collie mix nor any of my German Shepherds, and certainly none of my pit bulls.

    Sadly pit bulls and pit bull mixes are popular dogs so they are quite common now. The owners do not always understand what the breed is like, and they think their doggy needs to go romp with a bunch of strange dogs. As we all know, pit bulls are strong dogs and usually play rough. A pit bull might not start the fight but they will finish it and they will always be blamed for it.

    It is not worth that kind of risk to take any dog to a dog park. There are plenty of things you can do with your dog for exercise. Walking, playing fetch with ball or Frisbee, training work, playing search with objects, flirt pole work, and spring pole too. You build a better bond with your dog too.

    And of course the media loves to say any dog attack or fight is caused by a "pit bull", even if the dog is obviously something else.

    To oldman, yes there are quite a few instances of pit bull type dogs getting in trouble and attacking other dogs and/or people. Many pet owners do not know how to keep these dogs safe and some pit bulls these days have an unsound temperament. Unfortunately the whole "save them all" mentality will actually place these dangerous dogs in adoptive homes…

    This happened about a year or so ago in VA with a pit bull that was adopted out and about 4 hours later killed the woman's elderly mother… Turned out that dog had been on a euth list in NYC, then pulled, and eventually transferred to a "rescue" who adopted him to another person who returned him 2 days later when he attacked her son. The next adopter was not so lucky and it cost her mother her life… I'll see if I can find any of the old news stories about it as it is a good example of why some dogs should be PTS.
     
  19. GK1

    GK1 Little Dog

    ^^^^^^^^^If you read nothing else in this thread...
     
    Nat Ursula likes this.
  20. brindle

    brindle Little Dog

    Here are a couple of the articles about that pit bull adopted out that killed the woman's mother hours after he was adopted. It is a sad case and a needless death as that dog never should have been "rescued" in the first place.

    From what I remember on the back story, he was left at the NYC animal control because he was going after the child in his home. He should have been put down then.

    But nope, he was "saved", shuffled around in rescue, sent to a "trainer" who used a shock collar to "cure" him, then he was adopted out. First time to a woman who returned him quickly after he attacked her son and bit him, and then to the woman who brought him home where he killed her mother after she fell and he attacked her.

    Just a couple of those articles --

    https://www.nydailynews.com/news/na...rginia-woman-hours-adoption-article-1.3218415

    https://pilotonline.com/news/local/crime/article_42a5d18b-c502-52d4-ae17-42d26e8613a6.html

    Some dogs are just not genetically sound in temperament and should be euthanized. There are plenty of dogs with a good temperament without "saving" a bad one…
     
    Nat Ursula likes this.

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