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Temperament/Training : Male vs Female

Discussion in 'Dog Debates' started by SinfulDesires, Jan 23, 2012.

  1. Both dogs were already up to date with vaccines and were taken to the vet prior to mating. They were cleared and considered perfectly healthy by our vet.
  2. CelticKarma

    CelticKarma Good Dog

    O so you did not have health testing done =( I am getting more disappointed by the min. How do you know that the dogs have no genetic defects that they could pass on to their offspring, It is not like you know their bloodline history and a Vet giving them vaccinations and doing a physical does not by no means deem a dog healthy enough to breed. WOW
  3. cliffdog

    cliffdog Good Dog

    Wow... You should probably read up on why backyard breeders are not a good thing... We all make mistakes but I hope you do not breed again...
  4. I don't plan to breed again. This is not even a hobby for me. And I was under the impression that a Health Testing that in depth were for those showing and/or breeding. I didn't realize to breed "pets" genetic testing and DNA were required. I hope my mistake is a simple one and doesn't affect the puppies negatively. We even mentioned to the vet our plans on breeding. We needed a clinic or hospital that stayed open late on the off chance something went wrong. He didn't mention a need for a health test :( He just told us what to do and expect should the breeding be an success.
  5. @ Jackie...Puppies :)

  6. DancesWithCurs

    DancesWithCurs Good Dog

    You cannot train DA out of a pit bull any more than you can train the urge to smell everything out of a Beagle. That's what the breed was bred for, and that's what it does. No amount of "training" you can possibly hope to do will make your dog trustworthy enough to assure that it's not going to fight another dog when it gets the inclination to do so. Ever.

    Also if it was your goal to breed pets then you shouldn’t be breeding them in the first place and I sincerely hope both dogs and pups in this situation will be getting fixed
  7. While I respect your opinion I don't agree. So I will respectfully agree to disagree :) I have seen and heard of non DA pitbulls. It is possible with of course a lot of hard work and training. Make no mistake I am not planning on sitting back and allowing my dog to grow with no guidance, training or boundaries and expecting a miracle to happen. I'm dedicated to raising a balanced dog. And even if it doesn't then I was the problem. Not the dog. I fudged up somewhere and allowed a behavior to go unchecked and allowed my dog to become DA. What about other breeds who have other purposes that do NOT involve DA but yet they are notoriously DA? It's always the owner. Never the dogs.
  8. CelticKarma

    CelticKarma Good Dog

    If you have seen and heard of none DA American Pit Bull Terriers it is because they were born none DA not because it was trained out. I feel like I am talking to a wall.....

    Many here have told you that DA is a genetic trait in American Pit Bull Terriers, many here have told you that it cannot be trained out only manages. I personally own 13 dogs trust me when I say that if the dog is DA you cannot train it out. Like I said regardless of gender if the bitch is DA her pups have a high chance of being so also. Anakin and Eli are the most DA dogs I own, Anakin got along with everyone and everything until he was about 14months old, Eli turned on a little younger at the age of 7 months.

    That is pure 100% bullshit...

    It is painfully obvious you have not a clue....you have a DA dog that you use as a guard dog, who has no papers, no heath testing and you absolutely know nothing of the dogs history and you bred it to another dog that has no papers, no heath testing and I am sure you know nothing about it's history and you are here acting like your responsible ....LMAO...You really want to do the right thing? Have those pups fixed and the Sire and Dam, go to your local shelter and adopt a "Pet" a small no aggressive on like a labordoodle or something, gender plays no role to answer your first question, sorry if I sound rude but it is people like you that is causing our breed the most harm and it is sad. It really does not matter if these pups went to good homes, I imagine you think your a good home and that is not the case, another bit of advice...if your moving to an APT please make sure they allow Bully breeds because I have not found one yet that does.
  9. cliffdog

    cliffdog Good Dog

    It's not an opinion, it's fact. Learn some genetics.

    ---------- Post added at 09:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:26 PM ----------

    That's like saying "It's my opinion that dogs are actually felines."
  10. CelticKarma

    CelticKarma Good Dog

    exactly.....and a lot of us here has told her this FACT......
    The APBT and Aggression
  11. Boogieman

    Boogieman Good Dog Premium Member

    You mean like your female that just had puppies was in a forever home? This is why idiots shouldn't own this breed, and idiots should never breed their dogs. This whole thread is pathetic and you're a sorry excuse for an owner.

    Now that's what needed to be said and what everybody else is thinking.

    ---------- Post added at 07:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 PM ----------

    Thanks for proving my point about idiots breeding. :(
  12. Funny because I feel the same. If you thoroughly read what I said I agreed that once a dog establishes DA then it becomes a maintenance issue. But what I'm understanding from everyone that a pitbull is DA no matter if it displays DA or not. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    I live in a city where only privately owned complexes or what have you can determine to rent or not to a bully breed owner. I don't have that issue.

    I'm sorry that you feel my home isn't adequate or that I am doing harm to the breed by having mated my dog but I guess we'll just have to see. I will keep everyone posted on the good, bad and ugly.

    ---------- Post added at 08:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:36 PM ----------

    Well I was in my mother's home so it wasn't till I moved that it was decided she'd say in her current home. WTH is wrong with that? She is well taken care of and content not to mention I can visit her frequently. I honestly don't see your point Mr. Boogie.
  13. DancesWithCurs

    DancesWithCurs Good Dog

    You are. A pit bull should never be trusted to not fight, whether it has DA or not and should be treated as such. That means that no matter how friendly your pit bull is, you shouldn't be so stupid as to take it to a dog park
  14. CelticKarma

    CelticKarma Good Dog

    No, you still do not get it....APBT's do not establish DA it is in their genetics....what part of that are you having trouble with?????
  15. DancesWithCurs

    DancesWithCurs Good Dog

  16. Boogieman

    Boogieman Good Dog Premium Member

    My point? My point? My point is when you get a dog, you sign up to take care of that dog for life. Not dump it at first sign of inconvenience. You can skip around it all you want, this is exactly what you are doing. Sad and pathetic IMO. On top of it, now you've brought a bunch of crap puppies into the world, only for the pattern to repeat itself with you, and the uneducated owners that you're dumping these puppies on. Face it, you didn't know jack squat about the breed, and obviously still don't, before you acquired the first dog or you would have known that dog aggression is possible, and most likely to occur. Now instead of of dealing with it and staying dedicated to your dog, you're shitting on it and dumping it and telling yourself a bunch of bullshit lies in the hopes you get a dog who isn't dog aggressive next time.

    I stand by my original post. You shouldn't own the breed, and you sure as hell shouldn't be breeding and giving or selling puppies to a bunch of other uneducated idiots. You and your kind are the reason the overpopulation exists and BSL occurs.

  17. LilianaLove

    LilianaLove GRCH Dog

    My street mutt has had more health testing, more temperament testing, more sporting accomplishments, and, amazingly, more time in the conformation ring than either of the dogs that were bred. And she's "just a pet" too.

    I'm sorry that you don't see the importance of doing any of that. Perhaps, if you did, you would truly understand the breed you are producing.
  18. K9 Love

    K9 Love Good Dog

    Sinful - I'm normally the odd man out when it comes to training, but I do agree that if a dog, any breed for that matter, especially pit bull/mixes are DA you cannot "train the DA" out of the dog. Can I train you to not have two eyes? Or to write with your less dominant hand? I could force you to write with your left hand if you are right handed, but when I'm not around you will always revert to your dominant hand, or when faced with a situation where you have to make a quick decision on which hand to use. It is in your genetics, I can zap, prod, smack, punch and treat you to do what I want, but none of that changes your genetics.

    You manage it, through training. Often times dogs that are truly DA cannot be trusted offlead with other dogs, or left alone unsupervised. EVER. This doesn't mean that you can't train a DA dog to behave in the presence of other dogs, not to lunge, snarl and snap like a demon, but off lead often all bets are off.

    Dog aggression is a genetic trait. I think I saw you mention the bitch is DA, don't be surprised if the puppies turn out to be DA. Ie) If you have a black bitch, don't be surprised to get black puppies right?

    Not all pit bulls/pit bull mixes are dog aggressive. There is a huge spectrum that DA can present itself, from dogs that are merely tolerant of others, reactive (which can be mild or severe), selective the list goes on. The point is, pit bulls were bred for an activity that made dog aggression desirable, just as we breed labs to retrieve and they often inheritently know how to retrieve, pit bulls are often either full out DA, or have some type of intolerance of other dogs.

    I do agree that it's the owner. The owner is responsible for the care and safety of the dog. Part of that in pit bull ownership is recognizing the very real possibility of DA. Having a DA pit bull does not mean that the owner is lazy or uneducated. Now having a DA pit bull that is untrained and poorly managed...

    In regards to health testing. I'm not a breed fancier so I don't know what health tests are "required" (reputable breeders aren't required to do the testing, but they do because they know what health issues are common in the breed) but it's more along the lines of certifying hips and elbows (a vet takes x-rays and they are sent off to be evaluated), heart, eyes etc.

    What's done is done. I do not applaud you for having a backyard bred litter but hopefully if you stick around to check out this forum, you can be responsible and handle the situation as best as possible.
  19. SBTlove

    SBTlove Good Dog

    If you are going to be living in an apartment, I'd suggest another breed. This breed is genetically prone to DA and being that the mom is DA I'd say you have a pretty good shot at having a DA pup.
  20. WhoDoVooDoo

    WhoDoVooDoo Puppy

    Just wanted to chime in with my two cents here...I volunteer (was working for two years but recently quit) at an animal shelter, and I've seen two litters of "pit bull puppies" come in. One was a craigslist litter that was not fetching the price the owner wanted and he was dismayed that no one wanted his hippo pit mixes. Luckily, we got them in young enough that they were adopted out quickly. The other was a single mother who bred her "purebred rednose" to her neighbor's "purebred rednose". Both, as you said, were medically sound, up to date on all shots and so forth and so on. They gave us three of the pups and kept one behind with the mother, then later surrendered the last pup as well (he was fighting with the mother dog). Since this time, two of these puppies have been returned to the shelter: one with severe DA and the other with moderate DA and a blossoming HA (especially towards children). While the two families who adopted these two dogs may not have been the right fit, they were perfectly nice, kind, capable people. It was not 100% their fault.

    I have to admit I'm a little disappointed in the vet who did the check for the sire and dam. If I were him, I would have recommended fixing them right there and then. The shelters are filled with dogs who have stories just like your puppies'. Hopefully, they can avoid the same fate.

    As per a dog breed, may I suggest a gun dog of some sort? Not a cocker spaniel because they're just mean, but perhaps some other kind of spaniel or retriever. That seems to be more the temperament you're looking for.

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