Team No Fear

[CrazyK9]

Has anyone met any of these dogs? Were they stable in temperament?
Dont want to debate what breed they actually are just curious about any first hand experience. Or even heresay honestly!

 

[ShanaRowan]

My friend has a dog who is bred very similarly (I think has the same father or grandfather as Boogieman.) He's a very drivey and sweet dog.

 

[NobodyHere]

Let me put it this way. Clay is suspended indefinitely from UKC, so good luck actually getting a dog from them, regardless of the breed his dogs "actually" are.

 

[CrazyK9]

Oh trust me I'm not asking because I want one of those mutts lol. I was just wondering if anyone had seen/heard anything about the dogs being HA or otherwise iffy.

 

[NobodyHere]

Oh trust me I'm not asking because I want one of those mutts lol. I was just wondering if anyone had seen/heard anything about the dogs being HA or otherwise iffy.

Mkay, well the reason that particular person is suspended has nothing to do with the dogs' temperaments. I know that Boogieman dog (that one actually is an APBT, by the way) is temperamentally rock solid. Aside from that dog, it's all hearsay and speculation, and that isn't enough for me to comment on. The person is the one people need to watch out for, as far as I have personal knowledge of.

 

[CrazyK9]

I was going to PM you why I was asking and to ask you about Clay but I can't. I don't know if it was him I met yesterday or someone else in his circle.

 

[MMSmith]

I wasn't aware he was breeding. I know lots of people who comprise "Team No Fear"...it was my understanding it was more of a training club and he was its head.

Plus I think he's an asshole, and I'm speaking from experience here.

 

[ShanaRowan]

Boogieman died last year. And yes as far as I understand Team No Fear is a "team" of people and dogs, not a kennel. I think the kennel name is Real Deal Chocolates? And there is another one that I can't remember the name.

 

[CrazyK9]

I know the dogs arent necessarily part of, and certainly not from, one breeding program but the website has a breedings page so I can only assume theyre either breeding the dogs, as some are advertised as up for stud, or otherwise supporting breedings done with dogs of similar type.

I wish I knew which dog it was that sparked me to ask. Fortunately, I just missed him...

 

[NobodyHere]

Aside from that dog, it's all hearsay and speculation, and that isn't enough for me to comment on.

Alright, I'm going to go ahead and update this thread because at this point, the "hearsay and speculation" about the other dog I had in mind (Osy) seems plausible enough to justify posting about it.

The two dogs that Clay was regularly traveling with were Osy and Boogieman. There was a very clear difference in the way that he handled these two dogs. For instance, Boogieman was often out of the crate, and Clay often used him as a demo dog. He would leave Boogieman in a down-stay ringside while he helped to move block for weightpull, or do paperwork, etc. There were many occasions where multiple hands were on Boogieman, and he wouldn't so much as flinch. In comparison, Osy usually spent the entire time he was at an event crated. Clay would pull him out of the crate and lead him to the weightpull track, or whatever else he was doing with him, and when he was done, Osy was immediately walked back to his crate. I do not personally know of a single instance where Osy ever had anyone handle him or put their hands on him outside of Clay's "circle." We've always speculated that there was something off about Osy's temperament that caused this dramatic difference in handling.

I received very credible information that at a Mondioring event held earlier this month, Osy was off-lead doing (I believe it was) a retrieve exercise. After he failed to complete the exercise correctly, and Clay attempted to discipline the dog, Osy got away from him and redirected on a young lady standing ringside, tearing off at least two of her fingers and part of her hand. Someone had to shove something down his throat to make him vomit those parts back up. This happened in front of hundreds of people, including a UKC judge. Clay made excuses for the dog's behavior and refuses to euthanize Osy.

So, there you have it.

 

[BCdogs]

Holy shit, that's horrific.

 

[NobodyHere]

Holy shit, that's horrific.

Yes, and I want to point out that Osy is NOT an American Pit Bull Terrier. He's a mutt whose pedigree consists of Gottiline Bullymutts, Eddington mastiff mutts, and Castillo APBTs.

 

[Beret]

I wouldn't support anything that guy does. In his personal life or otherwise.

 

[CrazyK9]

Alright, I'm going to go ahead and update thread because at this point, the "hearsay and speculation" about the other dog I had in mind (Osy) seems plausible enough to justify posting about it.

The two dogs that Clay was regularly traveling with were Osy and Boogieman. There was a very clear difference in the way that he handled these two dogs. For instance, Boogieman was often out of the crate, and Clay often used him as a demo dog. He would leave Boogieman in a down-stay ringside while he helped to move block for weightpull, or do paperwork, etc. There were many occasions where multiple hands were on Boogieman, and he wouldn't so much as flinch. In comparison, Osy usually spent the entire time he was at an event crated. Clay would pull him out of the crate and lead him to the weightpull track, or whatever else he was doing with him, and when he was done, Osy was immediately walked back to his crate. I do not personally know of a single instance where Osy ever had anyone handle him or put their hands on him outside of Clay's "circle." We've always speculated that there was something off about Osy's temperament that caused this dramatic difference in handling.


I received very credible information that at a Mondioring event held earlier this month, Osy was off-lead doing (I believe it was) a retrieve exercise. After he failed to complete the exercise correctly, and Clay attempted to discipline the dog, Osy got away from him and redirected on a young lady standing ringside, tearing off at least two of her fingers and part of her hand. Someone had to shove something down his throat to make him vomit those parts back up. This happened in front of hundreds of people, including a UKC judge. Clay made excuses for the dog's behavior and refuses to euthanize Osy.


So, there you have it.

Yeah that trial was here in Texas. I drove out to FtWorth for it. Thats what prompted me to start this thread. People still had blood on them when I got there and were definitely still shocked. Animal control was still there. Police were just leaving and I missed the ambulance. BTW there weren't hundreds of people there as far as I know. It was open field day, they were doing socialization tests and a handler workshop w the judge. When I arrived, either all those hundreds of people left or they weren't there to begin with. It was maybe ten people from the club. They continued to practice on the field afterwards that day and continued the trial that weekend.


Guess word already got out...

 

[NobodyHere]

BTW there weren't hundreds of people there as far as I know.

Good, I'm actually glad that I must've misheard this part. All the breed needs is for something like that to happen during a higher capacity dog event. Hopefully that shitbag and his dangerous BYB mutt have caused minimal damage to our breed. More importantly, do you have any idea how the woman it attacked is doing now? I'm not sure who she is.

 

[CrazyK9]

Good, I'm actually glad that I must've misheard this part. All the breed needs is for something like that to happen during a higher capacity dog event. Hopefully that shitbag and his dangerous BYB mutt have caused minimal damage to our breed. More importantly, do you have any idea how the woman it attacked is doing now? I'm not sure who she is.

I dont know who or how she is But her missing two fingers at the time was accurate according to the people there. I didn't hear about the making the dog throw up the parts but having showed up after the fact, I didn't get to see anything first hand. I just know, there were people still with blood on their hands, literally. I think I heard a first name but that's it. I was an outsider to the club, having only talked to the founder online before (because he used to have Frisco dogs) so I suppose it was none of my business.

Goes to show, it doesnt matter if you think youre doing the breed a service by parading your dogs as APBTs when not all of them are, all it takes is one incident like this and it blows all your CGCs and other titles out the window! Makes me so mad! I had asked what kind of dog it was and the answer I received was "pit bull mix"... That mix part doesn't somehow erase the pit bull part that people are going to hear.

 

[Beret]

I hadn't heard about all that. Just his other seemingly daily dances through the court system and general shit-baggery.

Jesus. That's insane.

 

[kady05]

I hadn't heard about all that. Just his other seemingly daily dances through the court system and general shit-baggery.

Jesus. That's insane.

And you know he got off for all that shit he did? Trial was today. It's disgusting.

I've heard the Osy story as well and would really like to know how the lady is doing..

 

[Beret]

And you know he got off for all that shit he did? Trial was today. It's disgusting.

I've heard the Osy story as well and would really like to know how the lady is doing..

Yup, I saw that. That guy... Just. Nope.

 

[CrazyK9]

And you know he got off for all that shit he did? Trial was today. It's disgusting.

I've heard the Osy story as well and would really like to know how the lady is doing..

I was thinking about texting one of the club members whose number I have and asking. Would that be weird of me? Like, hey I know we only met briefly and I never even met the person who was mauled but uh how's she doing? I dunno, sounds odd in my head.