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Original Head Type - Proper debate placement

Discussion in 'Bull Terrier' started by WorkingBullTerrier, Sep 16, 2012.

  1. I've seen one blue fawn colored one on the internet, but that was it. Not sure if that'll ever happen enough to where offspring is produced for sale. I've seen blue creeping into other breeds though, like Bostons, Rotts, Labs, etc. Crazy.
     
  2. adjecyca

    adjecyca Good Dog

    blue rotties? What ? Are they crossed with dobies or something?
     
  3. davidfitness83

    davidfitness83 Good Dog

    I would love an all black BT with a crazy rear and crazy energy with no dog aggression lol How about you make me one of those? I'll even take a black and tan one too :)
     
  4. digs

    digs Puppy

    do you not see that what you would call a 'good profile' is extreme and unnatural?

    simple physics explains how it would make a dogs bite weaker (obviously if a dog really wants to bite hard it will,so there will be some exceptions),and the breathing,eating and drinkng problems are apparent for all to see.

    you're just accustomed to it and all the other damage your predecessors done,the next generation will take it 1 step further and damage them slightly more.

    if you bred for function disregarding looks, that 'look' and all it's flaws would die out within a couple of gens imo.
     
  5. It doesn't take all that much knowledge to oversee two dogs fornicating to produce litters of puppies to sell multiple times over the years, technically. Again, I don't think anyone is trying to claim their knowledge "super seeds" (lol) yours per se'. Again, that's that defensive reaction coming out again. Totally avoid the points being made, and just going full on defense. I can speak for myself that I am not attacking anyone personally here, I am debating facts pertaining to the breed. You choose to post in this thread, yet all I have seen from your posts is defensive jibberish. I have yet to see you once contribute anything productive here, OR answer the direct question that has been asked over and over as to WHY, aside from people selfishly 'liking the look', these dogs are being bred specifically to have extreme shaped heads? What reason other than human selfiishness? And that's what it is, selfishness. We aren't the ones that suffer from the results, the dogs do.
     
  6. I dunno HOW the blue Rotty cam about, but I have seen multiple pics through the internet of them! Blue/Tan German Shepherds too, I actually had one as a client a fe years back, it was NUTS.

    Oooooh yeah I'd love a solid black BT....I also am fond of the Blk/Tan BT's.......
     
  7. xchairity_casex

    xchairity_casex Good Dog

    i would not attempt to breed, nor buy a "blue" Bull Terrier as i could not imagine it being a naturally occuring color.
    as far as solid tri bullys thats my absolut FAV color, but i love solids in general, solid reds, solid brindles, ect. and i luckily have 2 *almost* solids Cesar is almost a solid red and Chimera is almost a solid black
     
  8. cliffdog

    cliffdog Good Dog

    I just want to know where I can get a BT like Shiner :lol: I don't mind looking at the round head I don't like every day if it works!
     
  9. Well.....blue occuring in BT's is no more natural than those over exaggerated parrot headed dogs like the example that were posted earlier, lol.

    @ cliff: His parents were from a kennel in CA. His mom is fixed now, but his sire is still intact. :) They kept his sister, but she's fixed as well. :) I love my Shiner boy.....
     
  10. xchairity_casex

    xchairity_casex Good Dog

    yes, but if you suddenly come across a Bblue BT then you can pretty much guess its nothing but a mix, if your wanting a mix then by all means look for a mix.
     
  11. I was speaking in general terms. Something not normally occuring.
     
  12. visiongee

    visiongee Little Dog

    Rats And Gophers have an enemy, its my English Bull Terriers Snout. My bt do weird things like sleep in the weirdest positions they don't drink a lot of water all the time but when they drink they F drink lol. I agree exaggerated features do lead to problems but there are still good EBT out there just don't settle.
     
  13. Hucklebutt

    Hucklebutt Banned Back Yard Breeder

    In all honesty I gotta chime in on this. I have 4 bull terriers all different style heads, Bowzer's head is not all that much different than Shiners, and Bowzer can hang on something for forever, off the ground, on the ground, if he doesnt want to let go he wont and he can hang on just as good as any pit bull i have ever seen, and i have the videos to prove it. I have never once seen the head of my dogs cause any kind of problems EVER cross my heart, i mean it. I have NEVER had my dogs choke on water, reverse sneeze or have any issues drinking water, and Ellies head is about as round as they come. Other than them being sloppy drinkers and getting it everywhere, never had an issue. I've never seen any of them have trouble breathing while holding on to any type of toy even if there face is squished against it. I've never looked at them and thought "i dont think there breathing very well while doing this." So hearing this honestly confuses me. Even ellie with a poor under bite and a severely round head can be swung around with a rope in her mouth, drink fine, and ive never seen her have trouble breathing. All of my dogs swim, scarlett is a major bike dog, she will go forever and screams like a husky when she wants to go, shes intense, she will swim laps for as long as she can, before we drag her out in fear she will collapse and drown. Bowzer can do virtually anything, a major point being is because he WANTS to do those things, and has major focus and drive. I think its about the want and the go in the dog. I watch my dogs dunk their heads in the buckets, gulp up water and i've never seen a problem with it. If I saw my dog choking on water or reverse sneezing after drinking water I would be really worried. People were breeding bull terriers for better heads for years and years, since the breed started. When dog fighting was outlawed the bull terrier was pulled because, well he SUCKED at fighting and was used mostly as a show dog, its from my knowledge they were poor fighters and made into show dogs and the companion. The head wasnt able to turn into the shape it is now over a short period, there are tons and tons of photos of bull terriers from a very long time ago with round heads starting out, it's been happening a long time now. The head doesn't do anything to the dog, OCD problems are not from round heads, it's my own opinion that OCD problems 90% of the time are a direct result of the owner, lack of training, lack of stimulation, lack of exercise. The bull terrier is an extremely universal breed that can do anything, i've seen them do personal protection (shutzhund) ive seen them weight pull, hang from trees, swim, bike, run up walls, and i've even seem them in the fighting ring (obviously not in person) but from videos.

    Are the heads getting too much, ABSOLUTELY! People are breeding these extremely round heads to the same thing and getting the most extreme breed change out there I think. I see heads that make me want to scream as they dont look like a dog anymore and certainly dont look normal. Everyone has an opinion on whether its ruining a breed or not, until it becomes a disfigurement, or disability its not ruining a damn thing. As I have said, I have never seen the head shape cause a single problem ever, ellie chases her ball every day, flies into the air and catches it, she can see fine even with her domed out head. Several breeds have been changed, the basset hound, the chihuahua, the GSD, in all honesty, there arent many breeds out there that look identical to when they started, nothing ever stays the same. There are bull terriers that look the same as they used to, and some who are far from it. A skinnier faced bull terrier isn't healthier than one with a round head, maybe it can run faster and longer than a heavier boned dog, but than again a whippet can out run a bull dog.

    I once met a guy who had a VERY working bull terrier, it had a small frame and skinny face, he got it from a well known kennel which name escapes me, but he claimed the dog came from i want to say germany from someone who bred these very athletic working bull terriers. The dog was mean as spit, human and dog aggressive, he told everyone to "get back he's vicious." What kind of image is that going to present to people who see him? Things like that may appeal to people, but its those people that see it and sign off on BSL papers that hurt us in the long run. He liked that dog because of the way it was built, and the drive in the dog, drive certainly doesnt mean he needs to be vicious.

    Everyone has a style that appeals to them, were all unique because of what we like and what we dont like. Hell I love looking at athletic bull terriers with define muscle kicking ass at sports and being the universal breed I know they are. What bothers me is when people take a dog thats built to be a heavier dog and brought to be this lean dog its body doesnt mean it to be. To me it just doesnt look right, sometimes you just cant remove genetics. I remember when I commented on a picture once on a different forum of a very what I feel obese looking bull terrier, when I commented on the dog being over weight they said "no hes not over weight, hes short and cobby, the maximum dog in the available space." And I wanted to say to them "you took up all the space alright, sure aint none left!" To me its just like the pit bulls, you have american pit bull terriers and the american bullies, both a "pit bull" of type, but different styles, there will always be people who think one or the other should be eradicated. But the point is, there is a demand for both types, and people who love them. Here are photos of my dogs heads.

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  14. Celestial88

    Celestial88 Good Dog

    Every breed that comes in black can come in blue. It's recessive so it can hide in lines for a very long time and no one will know until that dog is bred with another carrier.
     
  15. I'll tackle this more later when I get back from errands, but when I speak of ability to stay in hold, while CATCHING WILD BOAR....this is different from holding a ball, or rope. I wouldn't expect people who do not hunt or have never first hand seen a catch dog in action to understand....but when a dog is in hold on a hog, there are times where their muzzles get smooshed into the hogs body, or they end up submerged in water, or pushed up against things.....I'm talking about hunting here, working out in the field, not just exercizing like playing ball, or flirt pole, or tug. A hog is not like a ball or a tug, it moves, and puts up a fight, and potentially kill the dog. As far as the drinking goes, I will make it a point to make a video to put up here of my dogs. Like I said, I will respond more in depth later on.
     
  16. Don't your EBT hold them good? Yes, very extreme heads make difference on performance (I know because mine plays with one and the guy as to look up so he can bite, while playing and he has trouble breathing), but the head of yours is a normal head.
    You have apbt, so you know that an apbt even fighting lines can't hold as good as a EBT and they have normal heads, but this don't make them any smarter, a regular "new" EBT without a crazy head can perform well and a well conditioned one can perform stamina wise as a apbt.
     
  17. mottatron

    mottatron Little Dog

    Evening all! Interesting read. Here's my experience with Brando. I'd ay he has a medium head - not fully parroted and curved and certainly not old type.
    He's never been fought, but has always thoroughly enjoyed the fights he's found himself in over the years (which I don't encourage, but these things happen when other people let their dogs off the lead in public.)
    He's also never hunted (apart from catching a mouse once) so I cannot speak to any kind of ability with grip there.
    In terms of play etc, you won't get him off anything unless he wants to let go during a play. He drinks just fine, but very noisely.
    Here are a few pics.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  18. xchairity_casex

    xchairity_casex Good Dog

    Nice to see you! Brando has always been one of my favorite Tri colored boys.
    I personally would have to say Teeth placement and alignment would dictate gripping ability over head shape/size.
     
  19. bsand

    bsand Good Dog

    That's a nice head shape, not too 'extreme'. Reminds me of a BT my pup played with at 10 weeks and started to hump lol she was white tho

    Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
     

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