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Gamebred Guardian?

Discussion in 'Today's APBT' started by EDOGZ818, May 21, 2008.

  1. EDOGZ818

    EDOGZ818 Big Dog

    In a hypothectical world , where BSL doesn't exist:

    Would a H/A & GAMEBRED APBT be good in the role of guard dog?

    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2008
  2. fearlessknight

    fearlessknight Good Dog

    no...........not IMO
  3. Rai_77

    Rai_77 Good Dog

    Sorry, but I've already euthanized your hypothetical dog in my imagination :nono:
  4. tat2stuff

    tat2stuff Good Dog

    I've already euthed one in real life :(
  5. BlueRose_Kennel

    BlueRose_Kennel Little Dog

    IMO a properly trained APBT makes a great gaurdian but breeding HA into these dogs would not be a good idea.
  6. CoolHandJean

    CoolHandJean Krypto Super Dog

    Is there away to have a dog as a protection dog (trained properly) without the dog being HA? Or no?
  7. Boogieman

    Boogieman Guest

    HA and guard work are completely different things. One is genetic........one is fine training.

  8. Michele

    Michele Chi Super Dog Staff Member Administrator

    I agree with this.

    This is my post from another thread on this topic:

    It is a learned HA that is controlled. It's not a genetic HA that no matter what you do, you can't control it. So, in "work" mode, they are in a controlled HA mode. Not working, they are not. Am I making sense?

    It's not a genetic HA, it's a trained HA. For me, there is a difference
    Last edited by a moderator: May 22, 2008
  9. DieselDawg

    DieselDawg Good Dog

    A true HA dog can not be "called off"...not a good idea in any case.
  10. BlueRose_Kennel

    BlueRose_Kennel Little Dog

    There's a BIG difference between learned HA and genetic HA. Learned HA can be controlled (as it it a LEARNED behavior). There was another thread on this, I will try to find it...
  11. Rai_77

    Rai_77 Good Dog

    Yes. Big difference, imo. Like was said by Diesel Dawg, an HA dog isn't going to be able to be 'called off'. If they could be, I would be willing to bet there'd be a lot less fatal maulings.

    I'll go back to comparing it to soldiers. When they come home after the war (exceptions for those that suffer mental disorders from the war), they are not a threat to anyone. They only kill when necessary, and as part of the job they were trained to do.
  12. Rai_77

    Rai_77 Good Dog

    Agree. Which is why I don't really like saying that HA can even be learned. I think the acronym HA (noun) should be reserved solely for genetic fault. Protection trained/guardian type dogs can be aggressive toward humans and exhibit HA (verb) but it's not the same as being genetically faulty and having HA (noun).

    Like the difference between someone acting like a psychopath in a movie and someone truly suffering from psychosis.
  13. CoolHandJean

    CoolHandJean Krypto Super Dog

    Okay, that is what I thought, but wanted to make sure. So, why would anyone want to breed HA into any dog? It seems like it would go against the Protection training instead of help it.
  14. EDOGZ818

    EDOGZ818 Big Dog

    Good Points.

    So learned H/A is acceptable ?

    Is that an acceptable work role?

    IMO , some breeds are H/A and are bred for it , ( I don't actually know )
    IE: Rottwiellers , Dobermans , & possible sheperds , & proteection breeds.

    Is H/A acceptable for them?
    Is learned H/A acceptable?
  15. Rai_77

    Rai_77 Good Dog

    IMO, the breeds that are considered to be 'guardian' breeds should exhibit the willingness to be aggressive to a human should the need arise, and I wouldn't fault a GSD for attacking a human that entered the yard. These breeds patrol and part of their knack for protection is their ability to be territorial (protect the yard).

    To put a bit of perspective into it, I would think that a Retriever that hated water is a bit off :)
    Last edited by a moderator: May 22, 2008
  16. NYDog

    NYDog Puppy

    I would get a Belgian Malinois for guarding people or premises. Don't force a chihuahua to learn to retrieve ducks from a lake. He'll probably have a hard mouth to train away. A non-super-professional should stay away from aggression management in an APBT.
    There are enough problems with the breed w/o coaxing human aggression.
  17. Michele

    Michele Chi Super Dog Staff Member Administrator

    I agree:)
  18. Jelet

    Jelet Banned

    i am going to have to say... yes and no. Yes if in the right hands. and no because other people that are clue less will get it and yea.
  19. myo

    myo Puppy

    Guard work is related to prey drive, defense drive and fight drive, all of which are part of gameness IMO. HA dogs should never be used for guard work, that would just be dangerous. People who train for protection start with a dog that is ridiculously confident and friendly and that has a high prey drive and then mold it from there. The outcome is a well behaved, tottally trustworthy, well trained, well adjusted, well socialized, healthy, happy animal that will tear the Sh*t out of anyone who attacks you. Or that's the idea at least. The idea IS NOT to get a crazy vicious dog and train it to be more crazy and vicious, that's just an accident waiting to happen.
  20. ganja

    ganja Good Dog

    ok, well I have a lil question...
    why would a Pit Bull guarding his property be considered as a fault?
    I mean, a dog has still his own personality, regardless his breed, and if someone is crossing his yard or whatever, why would it be that bad for him to bark/growl?
    IMO, defending property and or his owner isn't HA but just them saying "hey, go away that's mine!" I could be wrong though... but I don't see how that should be HA?...

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