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Crufts Results

Discussion in 'Bull Terrier' started by Vicki, Mar 12, 2010.

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  1. Mollie's Nana

    Mollie's Nana Krypto Super Dog Staff Member Super Moderator

    Congrats to the dogs that won, and their owners/handlers, they worked hard for the win, and deserve the recognition. :)
  2. Mrpedigree

    Mrpedigree Big Dog

    So whats a better pass time for dogs ?? training them to fight??
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 16, 2010
  3. Mollie's Nana

    Mollie's Nana Krypto Super Dog Staff Member Super Moderator

    Pedigree/Clueless.... please knock it off and stay on topic. Enough with the name calling and pettiness. Please act like mature adults and put it to rest already. ;)
  4. DeeDirtyDawg

    DeeDirtyDawg Good Dog

    THIS is what i have against dog shows- DEFORMITY! dabilitating deformity!!!

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIaM3hYFszc"]YouTube- German Shepherd half dog half frog[/ame]

    looks to me like the GSD that won crufts (2007, i think) has one hella bad roach back!

    ---------- Post added at 03:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:51 PM ----------

    i can think of a better past time... how about the ORIGINAL purposes of the breed, or a reasonable facsimile thereof?
    whippets were bred to course. GSD were bred to herd and guard.
    rottweilers were draft and herd dogs.
    NO MORE!!! most of the breeds have even lost their INSTINCT as to what they should be doing! i have met terriers that don't know how to go to ground- scent hounds that don't put their noses down. what's the PURPOSE?? and leave fighting out of this, this isn't just about APBT.
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 16, 2010
  5. Hucklebutt

    Hucklebutt Banned Back Yard Breeder

    I agree, dogs should be judged based on function more than looks.

    I like this dog!
  6. Bullful

    Bullful Little Dog

    This isn't just about APBT

    "...and leave fighting out of this, this isn't just about APBT."

    And this, in a nutshell, is the problem all over the world.... where those who think they may be defending the bull and terrier and other breeds lumped together in the aggressive dog category, fall right into the BSL trap.

    Read and think a moment about how this post would sound to an outsider.
    Haven't you just linked fighting dogs and APBT's together. Just reinforcing the belief that fighting is what the APBT is all about.

    We should all be more careful.

  7. CoolHandJean

    CoolHandJean Krypto Super Dog

    Fighting is what the APBT was bred for, so, I do believe they go together. When I think of beagles, I think of rabbits. When I think of APBTs, I think of the pit. Dog fighting isn't what causes BSL. People who keep HA dogs alive or are completely irresponsible with their dogs letting them run loose cause BSL, but that is a completely different discussion for a different thread.
  8. DeeDirtyDawg

    DeeDirtyDawg Good Dog

    that comment was specifically aimed at a few who might bicker over that when i mentioned "original purpose". i still think that the APBT could and should be proven using other methods to show their abilities- rat catching, weight pull, agility, hang time, etc., but that's not the debate here- there's another thread for that.

    ---------- Post added at 06:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:53 PM ----------

    also, regarding that GSD there in crufts- here are some excerpts from the GSD standard which the dog CLEARLY shows faults against!

    . It looks substantial and not spindly, giving the impression, both at rest and in motion, of muscular fitness and nimbleness without any look of clumsiness or soft living.
    that dog looks both spindly AND clumsy, considering its practically crippled!

    Topline-- The withers are higher than and sloping into the level back. The back is straight, very strongly developed without sag or roach, and relatively short.
    the dogs here clearly display both sags and roaches

    Loin Viewed from the top, broad and strong. Undue length between the last rib and the thigh, when viewed from the side, is undesirable. Croup long and gradually sloping.
    i'm no GSD person, but those loins look pretty weak to me (as does the rest of the dog!)

    The whole assembly of the thigh, viewed from the side, is broad, with both upper and lower thigh well muscled, forming as nearly as possible a right angle. The upper thigh bone parallels the shoulder blade while the lower thigh bone parallels the upper arm. The metatarsus (the unit between the hock joint and the foot) is short, strong and tightly articulated.
    no comment for this except ROTFLMFAO!!!! yeah, what a joke!
    the gait of the dogs is also gone into in depth in the standard- and it pretty much describes exactly the opposite of these poor creatures.

    in this case, for crufts, they're not breeding TO the standard, nor exaggerating it, they're clearly breeding AGAINST it!
    and i saw a couple pix of what the bassett hound was bred from- what a cool little rabbit hunter! an actual hound dog that could hunt!
  9. Mrpedigree

    Mrpedigree Big Dog

    Because it was bred for it does that make it OK in this day and age ??
    Is it really that cool to see poor animals rip each other up until one is dead or close to it ?...i suppose its OK cause thats what its supposed to do:rolleyes:
    You say dog fighting don't cause BSL...explain that one to me :confused:
    Most of the over bred pups fall in to the wrong hands...or attract the wrong type of owners...no wonder young kids are getting their faces ripped up .....if dog loses in a pit it ether dies or is put down or if hes lucky dumped or given away...its then that most of these attacks take place !
    Dog fighting might not cause BSL but like someone hinted above its a contributing factor IMHO!
    My point was on this site we allow negative posts on dog showing but as soon as someone posts something condemning dog fighting the posts gets ether deleted or edited :rolleyes:...yet post something on training or fighting and that fine:rolleyes:..
    Only f**king "brainless" idots fight dogs or talk about it !
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2010
  10. mr.clueless

    mr.clueless Good Dog

    the trouble with people who have very little understanding of dogs is they jump to conclusions and use media sensationalism when it suits them for their own needs.....and then use they have no understanding of like " game " :rolleyes:
    personally i cant see what dog fighting has to do with this thread as this thread is about english bull terriers....a breed so far from being a fighting dog its like asking a corgi to be a scenthound !

    as regards the picture of the dumpy little red dog on this thread that just about sums up how low some folk set their standards.....an extremely poor,overly exaggerated overweight individual is deemed " a good dog ".....some people cannot differentiate between quality muscle and fat...

    as regards the " unique " head.....is that a good thing then ?.....if i so desired i could probably breed dogs with 7 toes on one foot with careful selection and hard culling......is that a good thing also....its unique !.....man destroyed this breed by trying to make them " different " and " unique ".......siamese twins are different and unique but its not good :no2:

    ---------- Post added at 05:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:30 PM ----------

    i have not said a word and will not do so.......after all,you can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink !.....i will leave the internet games for the folk that want to play them.
  11. Mrpedigree

    Mrpedigree Big Dog

    I brought up dog fighting cause i ask...whats worse ...showing dogs or fighting them ???
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2010
  12. mr.clueless

    mr.clueless Good Dog

    couldnt agree more.....but thats the show dog mentality for you.....reality is the last thing on their mind......the further these dogs are bred from what nature needed them to do,the less honesty you will see in them.......in 25 years i have yet to be told the benefit dogs get from prancing around a showring....and being bred backwards from nature.
  13. Jim

    Jim Good Dog

    Dumpy little red dog,lmao. I think it would depend on who is doing the fighting as to whether it is better than showing. Showing gives the individual dog no chance and usually if he wins he gets to effectively wreck more of his breed by being bred because we all know the health qualifications necessary to be champions.
  14. mr.clueless

    mr.clueless Good Dog

    fair point..
    i dont break laws myself,but i do recognise that 2 dogs fighting is the most natural thing in the world to dogs bred for such a purpose.....

    dog shows are THE most unnatural things in the world where freak show monstrosities are actually bred for on purpose !!!!

    so whats worse allowing a dog to be himself ( fighting ) or removing every last trace of what a dog actually is and turning him into a good for nothing fashion ornament who looks " different " ............i know what i think is cruel.......but then not everyone thinks with knowledge or experience.....some folk breed 1 litter of dogs and become instant experts on all things dog......and it certainly shows when they open their mouth.....fortunately most folk on this board have a balanced and informed view and can make comments without having to read newspaper headlines first !
  15. DeeDirtyDawg

    DeeDirtyDawg Good Dog

    no one's saying it's ok.
    but it is what they were bred for, so people think of it when they think of the breed, just as people think of herding when they think of border collies.

    ---------- Post added at 07:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:17 PM ----------

    or being bred backwards from purpose!
  16. CoolHandJean

    CoolHandJean Krypto Super Dog

    Showing dogs isn't cruel in and of itself, but purposely causing genetic messes are what people are talking about, i.e. what has become of the English Bulldog.
  17. DeeDirtyDawg

    DeeDirtyDawg Good Dog

    exactly. showing useful, correct dogs is a great way to determine correctness and show off the hard work of breeders.
    unfortunately, show breeders are now commonly breeding freaks instead of working dogs.
  18. Mollie's Nana

    Mollie's Nana Krypto Super Dog Staff Member Super Moderator

    Just because the "history" of the APBT is fighting in the pit, does not mean that is what they do today, nor is it "ok" for them to do so, being as dog fighting is illegal in all 50 states and the District of Columbia. Just because it is a part of the breeds history, does not mean that anyone on this forum sees it as "cool" to put two dogs together and let them fight... please do not make assumptions that members here do that. Responsible members of the breed realize that fighting is part of the dogs HISTORY, not part of their present. ;)

    Good point (the bold part), and I completely agree with you, some people take bits and pieces and make their own assumptions and conclusions, when they take things out of context, it has very little truth to it, but if it fits their needs, that's all they worry about. ;)

    You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink... and you can talk till you're blue in the face about how fighting is part of the APBT's past, it is part of their genetic makeup, it's what they were made to do "back in the old days". However, this is 2010, and dog fighting is no longer legal in the United States. If everyone would realize this, and accept it as fact, things would go a lot better, than trying to point fingers and insinuate that this one is doing that, or this one is fighting that dog.... it's ridiculous.

    and just for the record... not only are we NOT talking about the American Pit Bull Terrier here, but the Bull Terrier, I will only offer one more very valid piece of crucial information, and will ask all members to take into consideration respectfully, and stop with the "you just want to see dogs ripping each other to shreds... that is part of the HISTORY, not the current state of these dogs. These dogs are now loving, loyal, family pets, or dogs that do well in competition, whether it be fly ball, dock diving, weight pull, agility... it doesn't matter. In the 50 United States, you will not see any LEGAL dog fights going on.... and while the members on this forum accept it as part of the dogs history, we do not engage in it in today's world.

    Dog fighting is a felony in all 50 states and the District of Columbia, punishable by up to 5 years in prison and a fine of $250,000 due to the 2007 Animal Fighting Prohibition Enforcement Act. The federal Animal Welfare Act prohibits the interstate transportation of dogs for fighting purposes.
  19. Bullful

    Bullful Little Dog

    but i do recognise that 2 dogs fighting is the most natural thing in the world to dogs bred for such a purpose.....
    so whats worse allowing a dog to be himself ( fighting ) or removing every last trace of what a dog actually is and turning him into a good for nothing fashion ornament who looks " different "

    What if we were to substitute "man" for "dog" when we speak of natural behaviors?
    Man has always attempted to dominate, be it other humans, animals or the elements, and hasn't mankind fought from the dawn of time.
    Does this make it acceptable in todays society. Would this thinking justify the actions of the young school yard bullies if his ancestors/ parents were pugilists.
    Things change... do we go out and hunt our food, club it to death and drag it back to a cave. I think not, we have evolved and so have our dogs.

    I abhor dog fighting and the thought that people would stand and watch dogs tearing each other apart and call it a sport sickens me. What satisfaction can be achieved seeing the dog that you have raised and conditioned being injured or worse, killed?
    Leave the dog to enjoy life and step into the ring yourself, without head gear, mouth guards, and gloves. Take your best shots and then if and when you win, you have something to brag about. Perhaps you will win an autographed Michael Dwayne Vick t-shirt and poster. If not you get castrated at the very least so that you can not continue a loosing line. Or pehaps even culled, by electricution, drowning, shot or disposed of in some other manner.
    Far too many irresponsible people have allowed unstable, uncontrolled, and aggressive dogs to get into situations where the general public have been scared, injured or worse... resulting in laws being written that threaten your right to own a bull and terrier breed. It was posted on another forum that at Crufts a BT was grabbed and injured by another in the showring. People jumped in to break the fight up but many were shaken up by what transpired. Even in a supposedly controlled situation you had an event that will have a negative impact on the publics perception of our breed.
    Wake up before you can't own either the fat lazy distorted show freak or your game, fit, and determined working dog.
    Better enjoy their company while you still can.
    I wonder what breed will be next? Perhaps fighting Lhasa's

    I did bring up Crufts so I wasn't completely off topic ;-)

  20. Mrpedigree

    Mrpedigree Big Dog

    Give me a break ....thats all some members post about ....certain members not saying any names :rolleyes:....every 2nd post they make is about dog fighting or what works or what doesn't work in the processes in training your dog to fight !
    That can hardly be considered discussing the history of the breed now can it :rolleyes:
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