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Apbt Vs Am Staff

Discussion in 'Dog Debates' started by maryellen, Nov 13, 2007.

  1. 808

    808 Puppy

    Yup - have seen this first hand too. We went out to get some shaved ice and stuff on a family day out and as we were waiting a tourist and her husband came up to look at the puppy we had in the back of our truck. She's still not very big (only about 45-50 lbs at age 2). No one is ever intimidated by her and this tourist lady was just loving her for about 20 minutes, going on and on about how cute she was and how great she was, etc, etc, etc.

    Then she asked what kind of dog she was. I swear, the second "pitbull" was spoken, she was instantaneously moved to a distance of about 15 feet from the dog. Her husband told her she was being silly. He told her that the dog hadn't transformed into a different dog the moment "pitbull" was said. It was still the same cute, wonderful dog she'd just been fawning over for the past 20 minutes. Even so, she would NOT come any closer to the dog than that 15 feet she put between herself and the puppy at the mention of the word "pitbull. :rolleyes:
    It was nuts....


    And I agree with the others - all kinds of dogs magically turn into "pitbulls" when something bad happens.
     
  2. fearlessknight

    fearlessknight Good Dog

    LMAO......

    RiskyBusiness:
    "pit bull" is NOT a breed, but a "term" used to cover a few breeds, including your "Irish Staffy", here in the US...if you were here it would be considered a "pit bull type" and banned where ever they are banned, you would be no exception.
    Over here, they are all banned, if a dog (regardless of its genetic make-up, most of the time) even comes CLOSE to looking like a "pit bull" it is one. Over here they range from approx. (on average) 25 pounds - 130 pound and have a short - semi long snout and have a semi square head (some even round) any color, with 4 legs, and a tail. :D
     
  3. Sagebrush

    Sagebrush Good Dog

    I understand that the American Pit Bull Terrier is not allowed there in England. And the Staffordshire Bull Terrier IS. What about the American Staffordshire Terrier?

    Carla
     
  4. pitgirl17

    pitgirl17 Welcome Waggin

    Ok, this really helps explain what types of dogs are what. But I am still a little confused, so don't mind my dumb question.

    What is game? How do you know if you have that type of dog? What is good about game dogs?

    If you want to get into a sport, is there a certain type of pit that is better for one sport than the other?
    ex. weight pulling, or agility
     
  5. CoolHandJean

    CoolHandJean Krypto Super Dog

    Game means that it has been fought and has won and didn't cur out. So, you can't have a Game dog, unless you partake in illegal activities.

    However, you can have a GameBred dog, which means it's ancestry is from proven fighting dogs. They are good, because they are what made the breed the excellent breed it is today. They tend not to have human aggressive (sometimes it happens, but hopefully whomever owns that dog does the right thing and puts it to sleep). They tend to be dog aggressive, and even if they don't start a fight, if allowed to, they will finish it. They are the True American Pit Bull Terrier.

    As for if one breed is better than the other for certain things, I can't really tell you, but I'm sure someone in the group can help you out.
     
  6. doluseb

    doluseb Puppy

    Opinion vs Truth

    Most people have come to know the Amstaff(American Staffordshire Terrier) as the "show" bred APBT.

    Then:
    the STAFFORDSHIRE bull terrier as created in england (for fighting) was grouped with other bully-type pit-fighting and/or bull baiting dogs (bull baiting before dogfighting). ie: pitbull. was moved to the U.S. and became known as the AMERICAN pitbull terrier, though was not recognized as a breed until ~1890 (as best as I can remember, look it up if you want exact date).
    APBTs were small dogs bred for fighting. True APBTs did not get above 40lbs typically. In 1900 dogfighting was outlawed and soon after people began breeding the APBT for "looks" instead of fighting. ~1930 we see the new TYPE of dog coming out: the AMERICAN STAFFORDSHIRE terrier.
    Which brings us to
    Now:
    Today we see little variation in the Amstaff since about 70 years of breeding has only occured. This has led to our final acceptance of the BREED. (Insert AKC recognition date):D

    Opinion:
    Today in the U.S. we have poor occurrances with the APBT/Amstaff. We have uneducated breeders trying to produce bullies (breeding with bulldogs, mastiffs, cane corsos or other large breeds) to get large heavy dogs they term "pitbulls" or APBTs. Whatever the purpose (fighting, looks etc) they have no business breeding and our wrecking the breed, reputation of the breed, and contributing to horrible health problems with the dogs.
    In today's market (U.S. that is...Overseas the breeders make beautiful dogs) I highly doubt you will find a TRUE APBT, which as I said typically don't get over 40lbs. You'll see huge 90, 100, 110+ lbs dogs which are hybrids and DO NOT count as pitbulls. Hell even Amstaffs which are larger than APBTs don't usually get over 70lbs. True APBT exist, I just wish they were more prevalent so responsible owners that would like the keep the breed alive could find them more easily.

    Whether one chooses to go with Amstaff, Stafforshire bull, or APBT he will not be disappointed. Any dog willing to fight to the death (in sport (despicable as it may be) or war >sgt stubby) for humans is more willing to please, and loyal as any dog he can find.


    As far as the AKC vs UKC registration of Amstaffs vs APBTs goes, it is simply a difference in convention. Yes Amstaffs can be registered as APBT, but not vice versa this only came around because people became afraid to call dogs pitbulls or pitdogs.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2008
  7. Zoe

    Zoe GRCH Dog


    I always think of Irish Staffy's sort of like this

    Staffordshire Bull Terrier is like show version of the performance bred Irish Staff, kind of like American Staff is like the show version of a performance bred APBT.
     
  8. Chris_NC

    Chris_NC Puppy

    How comeThe AKC does not recognize the American Pit Bull Terrier as a breed?
     
  9. screamin'eagle

    screamin'eagle Good Dog

    they have from time to time, but the bottom line is that they took this breed and changed its name to Amstaff in the 1930's. The idea was that they wanted to take the breed, and seperate from its dog fighting past. That's where the name came from, and it was namely unpopular at the time.
     
  10. lilchampdog

    lilchampdog Banned

    Its quite simple and its all ready been said. APBT was breed for gamness, Am staff wasnt. The differents is staffs are curs. BUT, now a days most people dont test there APBT's for gamness before breeding and thats what it should be all about. Gameness over everything. So now they are more concerned with weight pull ,size, agilty, conformation, color, head size which is ruining the breed and making it revert back to an American Staff. Alot off people are undoing what took so long to do. The old dogmen are probably rolloing over in there graves.
     
  11. raylee

    raylee Puppy

    This happens to me all the time. My girl is a smaller American Bulldog and people always think she's an APBT. They'll be petting her and loving her and absolutley shocked that a Pit Bull could be so friendly so if I tell them she's an AB they're like, OOOOOOHHHHHHH, that's why she's such a good dog, it all makes sense. So, when Bama is good she's a Pit Bull out there changing people's minds and when she's bad, well she's an AB. :)
     
  12. espi

    espi Puppy

    ok i dont know it this is off the subject but i've been trying to figure out if my dog is a amstaff apbt mix. i know her mom is a apbt for sure. but i dont know about her dad. my friend owns both her parents and he says that he is an amstaff but i dont know he's huge like over 100lbs. and my dog is 80lbs. here's a picture of my dog sumi and her dad buddha judge for yourself.
    http://www.pitbull-chat.com/picture.php?albumid=444&pictureid=3286
     
  13. BrazilianPitbulls

    BrazilianPitbulls Little Dog

    in brazil they are a seperate breed, they compete against each other in the show ring. for amstaff they are also judged differently, they judge the apbt like they do it in adba by point system, the dog must look like a pit fighter for that's what it was bred to do. amstaff is show dog they're actually under Terrier group. a real apbt and a real amstaff you can see it clearly how different the two breeds are. I do think ukc and adba should stop akc dogs to be registered witht hem and litters as well. in brazil if you have for example a pit bull sire and a amstaff dam the litter cannot be registered its mutts ,mixed dogs. While here you can still registered them in UKC or ADBA as american pit bull terrier you can't go and register them as amstaff for AKC their mutts too.

    as far amstaff's I haven't seen any that are human aggressive they are more docile dog agression is low as well. but i think the mixing of true amstaff with true apbt is what makes those human aggressive ones, its two different genetic components mixed you know changes the fuses changes the genetics. A game bred dog true apbt i would say is the most lovable dog in the world I mean its love for humans is beyond anything of this world. They truly see their owners as God's. On top of that I mean they are just everything me as human would like to be, that strong willed, that determined, that agile, smart ,APBT should be one of the wonders of the world truly!
     
  14. The Apbt,amstaff, And The New Bully's Are All The Same Breed Period. Do Your Home Work They All Lead Back To The Little Pitbull Terrier From Great Britian. If A Breeder Selectively Breeds For A Certain Characteristic Or Trait Then That Breeders Dogs Will Look Diffferent Than What The Believed Look Of The Apbt "should" Be. Its No Different Than A Human. Lets Take John Any John Just A Man Named John If He Gets Fat Or Skinny, Gets Older Grows A Beard, Does Diffent Things, He Still A Human No Matter What Shape He Was, What Age He Was, What Mood He Was In, What Kind Of Work He Did, No Matter What He Has Two Human Parents Hes A Human. Just Like Pitbulls, Amstaffs, And Bully's The Basis Of There Being Is The Pitbull No Matter What Size They Become, Or What Temperment It Has, What Its Purpose Is, If It Came From Two Pits In The Beginning, No Matter What You Call It, It Has To Be A Pitbull. The Only Two Entities That Changed The Name In The Beginning Is The Akc (apbt=amstaff) And Dave Wislon The Creator Of Razors Edge (apbt/amstaf=bully) So If All These Breeds Are Selectively Bred Pitbulls Aren't They Still Pitbulls? The Answer Is Yes The Facts Speak For Themselves Do Your Research
     
  15. leharris

    leharris Big Dog

    what is your dogs blood line shs looks just like my dog tootsie size and everything. but where yours is black mine is choc her head is white with a choc ear. any how you have a very pretty dog
     
  16. Sagebrush

    Sagebrush Good Dog

    No, it doesn't.

    If you selectively bred Chihuahuas so that you got one that weighed 30 pounds, would you still have a Chihuahua?

    Do some reading on "type".

    Carla
     
  17. Yes It Would Be A 30 Pound Chihuahua. Black Is Black Even If I Call It White
     
  18. Sagebrush

    Sagebrush Good Dog

    oooooooo-kay.

    Carla
     
  19. shadowwolf

    shadowwolf Good Dog

    Please keep it civil. This type of debate gets heated every time it's brought up because our opinions on what differentiates one breed from another when having such closely related genotypes can be rather strong and we often can forget our manners.
     
  20. bullet08

    bullet08 Puppy

    Am staffs and and staffs all stem from Apbts this was for registration . Akc did not accept Pits because of there wasn't a written breed standard. There were still breeders who wanted the breed recognized by the AKC, so they decided to take lines from the breed and breed them in their own direction. They bred them for the purpose of companionship, and for the sport of conformation competition. Conformation competition is a show where the dogs are judged on their physical traits, movement, and handling, according to the written breed standard. These breeders wrote a new standard based on the one used by the UKC, and they continued to breed these dogs for 70 more years. Because of this the breed had changed in appearance and temperament. This spin off the original Pit Bull was no longer used for competition fighting, so their personalities, temperaments, and builds changed. This new breed was given the name The American Staffordshire Terrier or Am. Staff. The AKC accepted the breed and now considers this a new breed of its own, and separate from the Pit Bull. The new "Bullys" are a mix of am staffs and pit bulls.
     

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